So if you're saying that semi-auto and shotguns are enough for a government to worry about, doesn't that preclude the justification for more efficient arms from being legal?
Seriously. Wiskas is screaming about it being a liberal conspiracy to disarm the populace but with the huge demand it seems more likely the gun industry is the one profiteering here.
The next step will be to try and tax guns and amo out of existence. After all, that's how we are coerced into doing a lot of things against our will because someone else has taken it upon themselves to make a decision of what/how we should live. The man calls it a tax incentive. We already have background checks and waiting periods. And we're (statistically) more at risk of being killed by a car/accident than a gun/homicide. http://www.allcountries.org/uscensus/129_death_and_death_rates_by_age.html I predict we'll see many more crazy acts as the economy dumps again and people really start to feel the pinch. Then there's the copycat phenomina that all this controversy and media frenzy will cause. Still, not a single penny more has been earmarked for mental health. in fact, medicaid is going to take a humongous hit in Janruary along with any government earmarks for health and human services. Guns will be banned, people will be pissed over the 2nd amendment rights being infringed upon and absolutely nothing will be done about the causes of madman behavior. You are seriously hyperboling smersh. Where did you see me write anything about liberals? if anything, I'm not bitching about what's being done, so much as how it's being done.
You are taking a giant leap of faith if you honestly think guns are going to be banned. Yes purchases might get more restricted but they wont be banned outright.
An assault weapon ban is going to do nothing, just like in 94, it limited the production of the weapons, not the sale. Their never going to be able to stop the sale, or ownership. don't kid yourself. I agree. If the tyrants I'm supposed to be protecting myself from had AR-15's, I want one. I don't want a flint lock pistol. Common scene here. When the constitution was written, it would be like saying "you have the right to bear arms, as long as their are rocks" If a person wants to kill, they will find a way. if they can't get a gun, hell go buy a box cutter, or a knife , or a chainsaw. A chainsaw can do a lot of damage in a classroom full of kids. I refuse to accept that if thre was a ban on assault weapons and large magazines, this disaster would have been averted. And the magazine thing too, it takes less than a 5 seconds to change a mag. What they need to do is enforce better background checks on people buying these types of weapons, and guns in general. Background checks on mags maybe? Ammo? Keep this stuff out of the hands of the nut jobs.
Tell that to the 100's of terrorists and civilians being killed by drones. Your guns are going to do shit against a bunker buster no matter how deep your hole is
Gun sales go up because a lot of gun buyers are easily manipulated and the gun industry/NRA uses that fear to sell more guns. Again it's a culture of fear and ignorance. To add some perspective though; how many mass murders in the US have there been that was perpetrated with a gun? Now how many times have we had a tyrannical US government that was removed by the public via weapons? And with regards to having arms is a constitutional right, so was only allowing white land owners the ability to vote and that was changed. The constitution unlike the ten commandments are not set in stone and can be and have been changed. It's a BS argument is all I'm saying, times have changed.
Welp he's right guys, guess wed better just turn all of our weapons in, since there's no way to stand up to a tyrannical government now. Snark aside, how many children have our drones killed? But I guess that doesn't matter because they're brown people in the other side of the world.
It's only a BS arguement because it's not the arguement you are making. (*1)The fear/capitalism point you made is probably correct. It's how capitalism works in modern times. (*2) You want there to be a first time? (*3) That's why it's called the 2nd Amendment. The constitution has been changed from it's original form to include the right to bear arms. You want to change it back? Gun control that is presently on the books right now will work dandy if only merchants and distributors would put the law and public safety ahead of profits. we already have criminal background checks, no underage sales, waiting periods and gun registrations. There's a reason the system fails. Address those reasons.
Agreed. But they'll get restricted for no damn reason. Give me a junior 22lr semi-auto rifle with a pink stock and 4-5 clips, and I could go into an elementary school and kill just as many people. Hell, give me a few chain locks and a big can of gasoline and I could kill more. Perhaps, but do you know how expensive bombs and drones are? Without our guns a tyrannical regime wouldn't need them. I know this stuff sounds outrageous and paranoid, but history is chock full of people who became complacent and were overrun by their government. EDIT: Read The Prince, or (more recent) The 48 Laws Of Power. People who think that sort of thing won't happen again are just fooling themselves.
Setting aside all the emotional aspects of current events. While we're all arguing and concentrating on Connecticut's tradegy, and the gun control divisions, we're not watching and protesting the fiscal cliff manuveurings of the government. The real stuff that hits everyone right in the pocketbook and will affect everyone in a big way. The powers that be must be thanking the dirty deeds/tactics gods as we argue.
Why can't the solution be to just hire more police officers? Have them at all schools. 32,367 people died last year from automobiles last year. Granted that number has been going down every year. Why don't we hear about that every day on the news? I would think that that would help people think about the way they drove and drive down deaths in itself.If you divided 32,367 by 365 you would have 88 people motor vehicle related accidents.
That's a possible solution but it doesn't address the issue. I look at history and look back at the democracies that were over taken, they were taken over by groups that used fear. It wasn't some slow transition either. Your guns would have and will do nothing. While you take comfort knowing that you have a gun or access to guns to fight a tyrannical government your comfort betrays you and you ignore your responsibilities as a citizen and cast ignorant votes for the very people that would create such a government you would be willing to fight against. It's a false sense of security. Tyranny will come and it will be wrapped in an American flag carrying a gun. It's not a coincidence that the states with the highest gun ownership are also states that keep electing the only party that is and has actively passed laws to restrict your rights, including suppressing voters. But those politicians won't touch your guns though so everything else they do is ok So yes keep thinking guns will fight back a tyrannical government while you ignore the actions and intents of the people you keep electing. A self fulfilling prophecy maybe? When tyranny comes from the people you elected I wonder who you will be pointing your gun at? Ps My post isn't directed towards anyone but rather it's directed towards the argument itself which can be found anywhere there is a discussion about guns.
You said : "States with the highest gun ownership are also states that keep electing the only party that is and has actively passed laws to restrict your rights, including suppressing voters." Me: By suppressing voters I take it you mean voter ID law? From wikipedia: I had a chart in here but for some reason the forum doesn't like it. It is in the link at the bottom. This is how the laws per state look right now according to Wikipedia with regards to voter ID. Photo ID required: Republican (RED) states: Alabama, Georgia (Free voter ID card), Missouri, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas TOTAL = 7 Democratic (BLUE) states : Indiana , Michigan (doesn't really count because they can just say they "lost" it) TOTAL = 2 So out of all the states 9 of the 50 have Voter ID laws. Are states suppressing voters in other ways I do not know about? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_ID_Laws_in_the_United_States#Laws_by_state Where are you getting the information about the States that have tons of Guns = the same states that have voter ID laws?
I think your post highlights quite a few examples don't you? Just because they weren't passed or were overturned doesn't discredit what I stated does it?
I wasn't trying to discredit. I was just trying to figure out how factual that statement actually is.
The other funny/ironic thing is that the same people advocating restricting gun rights are the same people that railed against the Patriot Act. Restricting rights is fine as long as it's not one they support.
Yeah I agree, although they aren't as vocal so it's hard to group the two together (anti gun and anti patriot act). Then again couldn't you say the opposite? Restricting rights is ok as long as you dont touch my guns.
I appreciate that. I did look it up though before I posted. A little out dated but the trend should be similar. Finding a map showing political party power was a little trickier:
I wasn't trying to say you didn't but I am just saying there are a lot of so called facts out there all over the place. I am not saying you got it from a biased source either. I have been hesitant as of late to trust quoted facts these days because everyone is trying to use the "facts" to their advantage. I know how to do math and can take the time to see how accurate stuff is. It really doesn't stop of the fact if someone rigged the numbers but there is only so much you can do.
What do you mean? What specific rights of MINE are they restricting. Actually it doesn't really matter to me so, nevermind.
I was trying to wrap my head around that statement too. Because, while democrats are more vocal about getting rid of all guns, the republicans are trying to do the same thing. (see sig) It's not like there are any real choices at the poles. Tryany is on both sides of that isle. A matter to consider: tyrany knows no party affiliation. it just uses political parties as a means to divide and conquer. Besides, in Oregon, it's one or two counties that decide the fate of the rest of the state. The liberals concentrated in the one big metro area and it's the same in a lot of states. Check out califirnia's gun laws and compare it to gun related deaths/homicides. Then tell me how well gun control works. They've had a totlal ban on assault weapons forever and amungst the toughest gun control laws http://www.sacbee.com/2012/12/19/5063750/california-lawmakers-move-to-make.html. What good has it done them?
