Just spend an hour on facebook to see the spiritual state of the world's population. It astounds me the extent of which the trivial becomes so much more important than what really counts.
I just mention it, along with the knife massacre in China, to illustrate that guns really aren't the root problem. That, and as harsh as this may sound, I personally don't think we should infringe the Constitutional rights of 315,000,000 Americans because 20 children lost their lives to a lunatic that could have used a knife or a bomb or an illegal gun instead.
I am disturbed mostly by the media frenzy over this. With constant coverage involving little new fact, and interviews with irrelevant authorities. I stopped watching TV or listening to NPR, before they could get to the point of rehashing old gun control arguments, which haven't changed in the least since Columbine, and will lead to the same outcome as Columbine did. At this point, the media frenzy has left me unable to feel anything about the crime itself. Instead, I just feel contaminated by barrage of "reporting" when there was so little to report, just so they could be on the air "reporting"... It turns out that this person was indeed troubled on several levels, and people did know it. You certainly called that right.
^^^ And rather than punish lawful and peaceful gun owners, I personally think those people need to be confronted and dealt with. Sounds like the Mom was the most negligent person in this story, and has already gotten hers. But the close friends and family that turned the other way? The bullshit counselors and therapists? "OK, so you say you'd like to slaughter a bunch of people. But how does that make YOU feel..." There needs to be public education and an anonymous hotline. "If you know somebody mentally unstable that may or may not have access to guns, call 1-800-CZY-FUCK".
Goofus, glad to hear you eventually turned the media off. We often sit mesmerized by the 24 hour news cycle and then complain about it like a fatty who blames Hostess for making the Twinkies he gorges himself on. I might add that there was an incident in nearby (to me) Bolivar, MO, where a crazy planned to do a theater shooting and his own mother called the cops on him. http://abcnews.go.com/US/cops-stop-alleged-movie-theater-gun-plot/story?id=17742369#.UMymCHfQS9U MSP, you cite these incidents in China as support for your anti-gun-control position. But how bad would either of the incidents have been if all those perps had had assault rifles, or even pistols, instead of just knives? I actually lean slightly against gun control, but to my mind there are some compelling arguments in its favor. Maybe you should have to show the gun dealer a note from your shrink before you can buy a gun. But that's a form a control. What Smersh's cousin said on the Facebook makes a lot of sense to me. This is a problem that has so many facets it seems almost hopeless in its resolution. It won't go away any time soon, because we love our guns, we love our 24-hour news cycle, and for lack of a better phrase, we love our fear.
jimmies are seriously rustled. whats wrong with ppl these days.. this is how badly programmed people are now.
I actually would be in favor of some slightly increased controls, but the reality is that even in this case they wouldn't have been effective. You have an allegedly mentally stable person buying powerful firearms for someone who is obviously wacko. Typical female common sense and irrational smotherly love strikes again. And naturally the Dad is not in the picture. Our fucked up core family values and broken homes killed those kids, not the 2nd Amendment.
There's a few things about guns and our second amendment the NRA and kind like to ignore: -Our gun laws make getting a gun criminally easy. That means guns are everywhere. This increases the damage inflicted in mass violence groups. Sure people can and have killed or caused as much harm with bombs but with guns so easy to get a hold of, if you're the impulsive, 2nd degree murder type just grab one or two and go! -Few places have rules regarding how guns are kept and who has access to them. Even fewer enforce how they are kept. -Gun violence is different from knife or manual violence. It's detached and impersonal. It's also inherently more lethal, the China case is a great example of this. Sure a bunch of kids were slashed but none died and apparently not many had to be hospitalized for their injuries. Guns are tools designed to kill efficiently and it's a tool we're constantly improving. -Our society glorifies gun violence. Not even through this 24/7 news coverage. Movies, TV shows, etc have people shooting at each other all the time. It's not an uncommon plot device by any means. We demonize sexual contact in our media but glorify violence, especially gun violence then decry these events happening. Sometimes hippies are right, making love is better than making war. -Pro-gun groups reinforce all of these things. "The fastest reload is a second gun", this asshole showed that this was the case. Granted mowing down a classroom of crying children isn't hard work, but he was able to do so in a stunningly short amount of time.
I won't argue with any of that really, but what is the percentage of people murdered with guns each year? Even factoring in the black-on-black crime (which is done predominantly with illegal guns), the number of gun related murders in 2009 was just over 9,000. That's a rate of roughly 0.00003%. Drastically less than incidence of voter fraud, which we all agreed was statistically insignificant. So I should give up my Constitutional rights, but voter ID laws are outrageous?
Voter fraud was way less than 9000, it was like 100 cases in the last ten years. When you look at murder to decide what should be done I don't think the number you should be looking at is the total amount of people killed that just minimizes the need to address it.
And that wouldn't have worked in this case anyway, since the Mother who was shot, was the one who purchased the weapons in the first place.
On the contrary, the number of murders and societal impact absolutely should be a major part of the equation when we're talking about taking away people's rights. You can't have it both ways. "Voter fraud is statistically insignificant, so we shouldn't allow it to infringe on people's rights. But we can make an exception for the 2nd Amendment..." It's hypocritical on it's face.
Anyone else notice ALL of these shootings happened in "Gun Free" zones? The places where law abiding citizens are disarmed. Just saying.....
Please, PLEASE don't turn this into a gun-control debate. Please! I've had more than enough of the same old go-round. Actual statistics say it doesn't make much difference one way or the other pro or anti... it all comes out in the wash. The Giffords shooting proved that armed and carrying Citizens don't make much difference in these cases. Simply because only criminals don't hesitate before shooting, because they don't care. The armed Citizen at the Giffords rally was hesitant to pull his weapon, for fear that he would be mistaken for the shooter. In a crowd, only those who don't care if they hit an innocent bystander can shoot without thinking about it. That means that they shoot first, and they shoot more. Pro or anti, it just doesn't really matter, compared to criminal intent.
i guess that means i'm gonna be next..... come get me thoughtpolice, i'm about to commit thoughtcrime. as someone who has served a (thankfully short) military career, i'm all for mental screening before anyone is allowed to come close to a firearm.... multiple times i have almost been shot by my own "friends"... the first time it happens, it's nerve racking and makes you seriously consider what you're doing for such a small amount of money.... the second time it happens, you're pretty much convinced you're going to be taken down by friendly fire.... and #3 is what made me a conscientious objector.
I'm about to disable my Twitter feed again, CNN sends me dead children updates about every 10 minutes. And the few comedians / celebrities I follow are spouting all sorts of gun control nonsense. Except for Weird Al, thank you Weird Al... So Goofus, to your point about not making this a gun control debate I wholeheartedly agree. Unfortunately its your liberal brethren you need to convince.
To those that want to throw the china/knife-USA/gun comparison away because of the degree of lethality: would it be better if we had the same controls, both societal and citizen weaponry, as china does (they do go hand-in-hand)? And we all knew that this would become a gun control rally cry for liberals that think that through legislation, they can create a utopian paradise if only we'd all get well and fall in line. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012...215?feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews&rpc=76 For one (considering the articl) assault weapons were not the tool used. Sure, there was one in the car, but not on the person. For two: gun controls were not capable of doing a damn thing here. For three: I think we're all fuct when a political entitygrabs onto a situation like this to further a political agenda. For four: It's only going to lead to more anger and rage when crazies see how this nation will be gullible and fall for media hype and political propaganda in order for the nation to beg congress to take away our rights as defined within the bill of rights. Outlaw guns, then only outlaws will have guns. propaganda or not.....you decide: http://www.saf.org/journal/16/thefailedexperiment.pdf I'd tend to believe that a move to take guns away from law abiding citizens is a pre-emtion to the bullshit coming down the pike (via auterity moves and power grabs) more than a real desire to keep us all safe from gun violence.
Call me old fashioned if you'd like, but nobody will ever take my weapons away from me. I bought and paid for them, and own every single weapon legally. I realize that I have some controversial weapons (especially my FAL .308 assault rifle with the folding stock). But, I will never give up this gun. I built this rifle with the help of my father-in-law, and am very proud of it. ~Will Courtier~
This all comes at a time that's most advantagous to congress. A great time to advocate gun bans and take people's minds off of the disgust building over the congressional lack of performance and impending austerity due to taking the plunge off of the fiscal cliff. Get ready for huge tax increases, they are coming and have been part of the plan all year long.
i am sick to my stomach some of you honestly believe more gun control laws will "fix" any of this. please wake up and actually think.i mean really THINK. guns are banned in most countries around the world and it has not stopped mass shootings in any of those countries. why? because laws do not affect criminals. only law abiding citizens. more people die in car accidents every year then they do to guns. and there are a shit ton more guns out there than cars. i could sit here and type up a long list of ways to ban cars for killing people. i could say honda cars are responsible for more deaths than any other vehicle on the road but to blame a car or the brand of car is utterly ridiculous and stupid. maybe we should only allow public transportation in america. it will solve a lot of problems. no more speeding. no more DUI's. no more talking/texting while driving. no more paying for gas or vehicle maintenance. no more paying for insurance. it will also lower emissions around the world and help with globing warming. it will solve a LOT of problems and save a lot of lives and money for the everyday person. so how about it? lets take away all your personal vehicles for the better of society? ...a car, gun, knife, or bomb...they are inanimate objects and only work according to the person behind them. bad people will do bad things.
I think it's funny every time I say this isn't a gun control issue five of you start wailing that it shouldn't be a gun control issue. I said I lean against gun control laws, yet I've never owned a gun and don't plan on it. Guess what, your lives won't end if you don't have a gun. I worry more about the gun culture than I do about guns-- this "I gotta have my guns at all costs", "no law will create a utopia", and "cars don't kill people, drivers do" hyperbole. Take a fuckin' valium. Europe seems to do OK with strict gun control laws. There are some mass shootings but the overall homicide rates are significantly lower than in the US. But they are in Canada, too, which has relaxed gun laws like the US. Maybe our population has become too dense, maybe that's the difference between the US and Canada here. Or maybe it's the decay of the nuclear family (or the decay of the stable neighborhood) in the US. I don't know how Canada fares with that. Just thinking out loud.
You can add that you can't spank a kid but I have heard a numerous amount of people say that is just what they needed as a child. Seems like that is also what a bunch of this current teenage generation needs.
