Armed protestors at Obamas town halls?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by ivwshane, Aug 17, 2009.

  1. mistawiskas

    mistawiskas kik n a and takin names

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    QFT.
    The reason an understandably complicated bill gets complicated beyond total belief, is the special interests. if this set of bills was written with the welfare and health of the American people first and foremost, it'd have been done already. But the represenatives do not keep the publics welfare in mind when they wriote this shit up. it's the medical lobby, the insurance lobby, the elmer fud lobby, any lobby that has outstanding markers waiting to be paid back, that gets to have their interests concidered. Therefore: HB3200 and all the ammendments that'll add another 1500 pages to it. It turns into a : "if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit" sequence.
  2. ivwshane

    ivwshane We are all old school!

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    I can't tell if you are getting mad at me or the situation but for clarification, I'm just the messenger.
    I agree with you in that the president needs to have a clear cut agenda that he can sell to the American public (especially with him being so popular).
    I think Obama not taking a hard line position is hurting the cause.
  3. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    I'm not mad at you shane, just fed up. Not sure if you're being sarcastic about Obama being popular though. His approval numbers are in the low 50's I believe.
  4. GRP

    GRP oh snap

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    Like I said, it's too expensive and you're just hurting the majority of people who are okay. There are any number of less drastic options that will lower costs, but we can't have that I guess.
  5. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    Here's an article by John Mackey. He's the CEO of The Whole Foods grocery stores.

    John Mackey: The Whole Foods Alternative to ObamaCare - WSJ.com

    He's a liberal. He runs his business on liberal ideals but because he doesn't support Obama's "Goal" he's being demonized by a faction of his own party. He's come up with some other ideas that don't include the proposed health care bill. Because of that, his own people are calling for a boycott of his company.

    Boycott Whole Foods | Facebook

    Do a google search and read some of the hatred for the man.
  6. Coleman

    Coleman fresh off the corner

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    Nancy Pelosi is a drunk whore
  7. ivwshane

    ivwshane We are all old school!

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    There is definitely a lot that can be done to reform health care and at the very least make it more consumer friendly.

    One of the issues is that even if we don't cover the 50 million or so people that don't have coverage we still end up paying for them.

    The question then becomes: Do we spread out the costs among everyone in the US and pay a smaller "penalty", or do we continue to "fine" those that currently have health care?

    And that's just a small portion of the debate.
  8. ivwshane

    ivwshane We are all old school!

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    Faction of his own party? What faction are you talking about? I've never even heard of this guy in relation to health care and I haven't heard anything about this boycott either.
  9. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    I used the term "Faction" because I wasn't going to say ALL liberals were going to boycott him. Don't you have a Whole Foods grocery near you? The man is a very successful, Liberal businessman. Like I said....just google "Boycott Whole Foods."
  10. ivwshane

    ivwshane We are all old school!

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    I could google anything and find something that supports or disproves my point of view. My point is that you make it seem like this is a big deal and has huge support from liberals and I just haven't seen any evidence that supports your claim.

    When it gets to the point where it gains national attention like the birther movement then I'll concede to your point. Until then, let me just say this, it's on facebook who the hell cares!
  11. ninefivezero

    ninefivezero infinite resolution

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    Maybe you should "do a google" before you speak...

    As for the boycott.

    The people pushing for a boycott are idiots.

    The CEO is a shitty businessman.

    Let me explain.

    Anyone who puts their faith and puts their own values on a corporation is simply stupid. The only "value" a corporation cares about is the value of their stock, because that is their job, to make a profit. To assume that because you hold a certain set of values (liberal, conservative or otherwise) and shop at a store that is well known for others holding the same value set, that therefore that store must also hold those values is ignorant. Tac, you have fallen into this same fallacy.

    For the CEO to enter this debate, saying things that directly go against the value set everyone knows the stores shoppers generally are thought to hold is probably even more stupid. I don't know if the guy is simply stupid, willfully ignorant, or maybe so arrogant that he doesn't know anything about his own customer base. It has to be one of the three it would seem, but whichever one it is, it adds up to a bad businessman because by opening his mouth when he didn't need to, he has hurt his own business.
  12. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    Aww Fiddy it just wouldn't be T3D without you poking a jab at me now would it. Now back to the point. When it comes to business the guy does claim to be a Libertarian, not a Conservative as some on the left are stating. But in college he was a Democratic Socialist according to his Wiki and later changed when trying to run a business. The way he runs his business and treats his employees not to mention him being a Vegan leads me to believe he leans pretty far left.

    His company bought out their competitor for $670 million dollars. His company was one of only two Fortune 500 companies listed among the 25 Best Companies to Work For in 2005.

    Sound like a stupid business man to you still?

    Fiddy will you shop anywhere or eat anywhere regardless of how the company is run, how it's people are treated and who's campaign they donated to? None of that hinders your decision? If does hinder my decision sometimes and it's not a fault. It's called having a conscience. However in this case the people calling for the boycott are idiots as you said. He hasn't acted on anything or somehow changed the proposed bill, he simply gave his opinion. And again, the track record of his company I think speaks volumes about the fact he is not a shitty businessman.
  13. -=Lurker=-

    -=Lurker=- **BANNED**

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    I feel bad for going to walmart on those rare occasions.... :(
  14. GRP

    GRP oh snap

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    My company will crush Whole Foods beneath it's steel toed boot.

    Goddamn hippy food.
  15. Torx

    Torx Indigenous Nudist

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    whole foods aka wild oats, here, are a bunch of assholes. the women that work there are self righteous cuntbags.

    i love this fiddy and tac drama. makes my day everytime.
  16. tex

    tex jive turkey

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    I used to hate whole foods for being overpriced, but their preprepared section is actually a pretty damn good deal. You can get a huge pepperoni roll for $2.50, and the breakfast tacos are $2/ea or so. My girlfriend has suckered me into going there a few times for breakfast (we go to the farmer's market right down the street most saturday mornings) and I actually dont mind anymore. the rest of the place still sucks and is overpriced though

    That is total horseshit. I'm sorry you hate corporations so much, but that isn't the case. Yes, the primary motivator is profit, but a corporation also has values, such as enron where energy trading fraud was par for the course, versus joe's plumbing down the street where his entire business rides on honesty.
  17. mistawiskas

    mistawiskas kik n a and takin names

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    sorry to say, "joe's plumbing " will probably not be able to compete. The motivation of "profit" is cool..............unless it becomes the only motivation.
    i, personally, do not have a problem with big business until the time comes when scams take the place of honesty, integrity and quality. This would seem to be the case. The bottom line is the only concideration in a lot of cases and we are now seeing the results: one big bubble after another.
    This particular thing has trhe potential to really turn into a huge profit/big brother thing: U.S. grants $1.2 billion for electronic health records | U.S. | Reuters.
    imagine the access the government has to unprecidented amounts of person information now. not to mention the selling of marketing data as in the case of the internet.
  18. tex

    tex jive turkey

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    in what regard? if you're saying its because its a small business, not true at all. You can beat out the big guys, you just have to compete in a way other than price. Customer service, knowledge, etc. People are going to appreciate you even when you charge $10 more per hour if you do things like admit when you're wrong and take steps to correct it, show up on time, etc. Stuff that the big companies don't "value". Yes, a lot of the huge corps throw everything else out the window in pursuit of profit, but that isnt a blanket case
    I don't know what this misconception is about not being able to hang with the big guys. I even know lawyers here that run tiny practices (2-3 attorneys plus supporting staff) and are doing quite well for themselves. Yeah, they're not making a lot more than the $150k the big firms start their first year attorneys at, but they also own their firm and get to basically pick what and when they work. You can compete with just about anyone except walmart. You just have to do it in a way besides scale
  19. GRP

    GRP oh snap

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    You know that's like saying you can't have faith in people because the only thing they care about it staying alive.

    Sure, when the chips are down survival comes first, but when things aren't as bad corporations, like people, can do plenty of good things.
  20. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    We have one Whole Foods here but I've never been there because it's not really close to me. Now I'm interested so I'll probably go.....just wont buy anything frozen because of the drive though. Are the men that work there different or aren't there any men?

    As far as the drama goes, I don't much care for it. He and I are polar opposites it seems when it comes to politics at least but, I'm not looking to rub his face in anything.....just spirited debate.
  21. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    Funny you should mention profit. Remember how pissed off at Dick Cheney people were when they found out that Haliburton was getting huge government contracts during the war in Iraq.
    Well David Axelrod, Obama's top political advisor, is owed $2 million in stock sales from the same PR firm that's doing the Pro-Obama care ads. It may be nothing but, it does seem shady.
  22. ivwshane

    ivwshane We are all old school!

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    It is shady and shit like that pisses me off! If it wasn't in the constitution I'd have lobbying banned.
  23. Tacdriver

    Tacdriver Junior Member

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    From what I've read the PR firm owed him the money before he entered The White House so to be fair, maybe it's really nothing.....just ironic.
  24. mistawiskas

    mistawiskas kik n a and takin names

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    I'm not speaking solely against big biz here. Joe the plumber, the guy with ethics and morals, not only has to compete with unscrupulous big guys, but the small guys that cheat and cut-bid due to utilization of illegals. you're talking the field i work in also. The honest, hard working individual suffers in business because of companies that cheat. Joe has to pay his journeyman X amount of dollars an hour, then, on top of that, 31-45% more for SSI, medicare, workers comp, unemployment, unemployment assesment, benefits,
    biz tax etc. The guy he competes with and looses many bids to, hires illegals, pays 15 bux an hour and no other overhead on that worker. when the economy goes tits up (like now) people pay the cheapest amount for a bid without reguards to whether the contractor has workers who cannot speak english.

    before he was in the whitehouse, wasn't he chief of staff at the pentagon?
  25. tex

    tex jive turkey

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    ah gotcha. sorry, that was probably a bad example :)